9:55AM
Carter Lyons has joined this chat.
Math and Computer Science: video is running
Donna Nonnenkamp: The connection for quicktime audio is rtsp://165.134.240.33/audio0716a.sdp and the connection for quicktime video is rtsp://165.134.240.33/video0716a.sdp
Donna Nonnenkamp: please type in the addresses do not click on the links
Math and Computer Science: Jessica, are you in the chat?
sklarjk: Yes, I'm here.
Math and Computer Science: thanks
Meral Arnavut: I am having a problem with my quicktime file today.
janetlbeery has joined this chat.
Math and Computer Science: We have put two syllabi on the web site in pdf format - on the Program page
Meral Arnavut: I cannot even open the file. It flashes and goes away immediately.
Meral Arnavut: I will keep try.
10:00AM
Dominic Soda has joined this chat.
Donna Nonnenkamp: Meral, please close quicktime completely and try again
Donna Nonnenkamp: file open url in new player
Meral Arnavut: I cannot even open quicktime. That's the problem!
Donna Nonnenkamp: meral -please restart your computer - my guess is that you have more than one copy of quicktime open
Meral Arnavut: Do you think I shoud rebug my computer?
Meral Arnavut: Okey, I will..
Meral Arnavut has left this chat.
Silvia La Falce went offline before accepting your invitation.
Silvia La Falce has joined this chat.
Silvia La Falce: Ok! Hi!
Math and Computer Science: great, Sylvia
Jim Woeppel has joined this chat.
Math and Computer Science: hi, Jim
10:05AM
Meral Arnavut has joined this chat.
Juli Rainbolt: repeating links:
Donna Nonnenkamp: The connection for quicktime audio is rtsp://165.134.240.33/audio0716a.sdp and the connection for quicktime video is rtsp://165.134.240.33/video0716a.sdp
Jim Woeppel: Hi. Thank for the email on Workspace
Donna Nonnenkamp: Please type this in do not click on the link
Math and Computer Science: you're welcome
Donna Nonnenkamp: Meral are you connecting ok now?
Meral Arnavut: All right, I am set now. Thanks.
Donna Nonnenkamp: good Meral
Robert Talbert: I had a question about the LogTo command...
Robert Talbert: Specifically, how to end the logging. I looked this up in the help files and it gave the command "LogTo( )!" but I think I must be misunderstanding the command, because it gives me an error message.
Juli Rainbolt: to stop logging type LogTo();
Juli Rainbolt: note there is no name or '' inside the parentheses.
Robert Talbert: Ok. For some reason there was an ! in the help files and I kept entering that, which was giving the error. Thanks
10:10AM
Ayan Mahalanobis has joined this chat.
Math and Computer Science: welcome, ayan
Dominic Soda: The editor <->gap integration is poor on the pc that is why i am looking at emacs
Robert Talbert: Actually Carter sent me a very helpful response to my question, but the more the merrier.
Dominic Soda: The fp groups stuff is easily avoided i think
10:15AM
Robert Talbert: Our course is a four-hour course, so I have time in the course to have a "lab day" in which the whole time could be spent on a single computer project.
Robert Talbert: I can see fp groups presented (pardon the pun) as a discovery-type lab project.
drvazz: We have a two-semester sequence (only one semester is required)...
drvazz: I'd be interested in hearing about topics people have used Gap for in the second semester
Robert Talbert: GAP seems to have a lot of potential for applications in cryptography (which I'm particularly interested in) e.g. polynomials over finite fields.
Robert Talbert: If the second semester is more geared towards advanced apps, then that's a possibility.
brooksbankpa: it's very nice as long as the finite fields are not too big; otherwise MAGMA is better.
Janet McShane: Have you used Gap in a graduate abstract algebra course?
drvazz: thanks for the ideas...I'll check the website, too
Robert Talbert: Peter -- I've never used magma, so how big is too big?
brooksbankpa: roughly GF(2^16) is GAP's limit
brooksbankpa: MAGMA is much better...but not free...
brooksbankpa: better for finite fields, that is!
brooksbankpa: me too
Dominic Soda: 2^16 is large enough for most undergradaute course i think
10:20AM
Dominic Soda: would you expect them to know elementary number theory at this point
Math and Computer Science: not necessarily
Math and Computer Science: Gallian's text has some material on gcd, division algorithm, at the start of the book
Dominic Soda: so they would know what Integers mod 12 means?
Math and Computer Science: we teach it in the course
sklarjk: Can you get GAP to list the elements of z?
10:25AM
brooksbankpa: z is an element.
sklarjk: Oh, I see, z is a generator. Sorry.
Carter Lyons: The symbol Z(7) id bneing used in two ways.
Carter Lyons: z::=Z(7) seems like the ring itself and and in 0*Z(7) it looks like an element.
Dominic Soda: lost audio
Dominic Soda has left this chat.
Dominic Soda has joined this chat.
drvazz: I never lost it
Juli Rainbolt: R is the ring
Dominic Soda has left this chat.
Carter Lyons: So inthe statementZ:=z(7), The Z(7) is known to GAP.
Math and Computer Science: yes
Math and Computer Science: Z() is a function in GAP
10:30AM
sklarjk: Will it pick the same generator every time?
Robert Talbert: Yes -- this procedure only works when we set z := Z(p) where p is a prime power. That Z(p) is evidently a reserved symbol in GAP.
janetlbeery: Is there a way to not use the Z(7) notation, e.g. use just z instead? Looks as if Z(7) communicates to GAP that we want 7 elements, unfortunately. Looks as if my question was just answered!
brooksbankpa: also z:=Z(p) immediately puts z in a field; note that GAP recognises R as the field GF(7)
Math and Computer Science: right
sklarjk: p actually has to be a prime, yes? Not a prime power?
Carter Lyons: are we really paused?
brooksbankpa: prime power is OK too
sklarjk: The Int function doesn't seem to work when p is a prime power, however.
Ayan Mahalanobis: What about composite number?
brooksbankpa: not if it's not a prime power
Robert Talbert: Composite numbers don't work because the nonzero elements don't form a group under mult
Donna Nonnenkamp: Carter is everything working ok?
brooksbankpa: Z(p^k) is the generator of GF(p^k) in GAP
Carter Lyons: yes. I restarted quicktime.
Dominic Soda has joined this chat.
Donna Nonnenkamp: good carter
sklarjk: But can we find out which generator it is when we
sklarjk: are dealing with p^k?
10:35AM
sklarjk: Ok  .
Donna Nonnenkamp: Dominic, The connection for quicktime audio is rtsp://165.134.240.33/audio0716a.sdp and the connection for quicktime video is rtsp://165.134.240.33/video0716a.sdp
Donna Nonnenkamp: Dominic, are you back?
Dominic Soda: my audio is fixed it was windows again
Donna Nonnenkamp: sorry dominic
drvazz: Is it supposed to be a^2+b^2=0, then?
Math and Computer Science: yes
drvazz: Handout has a^2|b^2=0
drvazz: (Font problem, maybe?)
10:40AM
Math and Computer Science: that | is a + on my pdf file
Math and Computer Science: yes, a font problem!
Math and Computer Science: with acrobat
Dominic Soda: it is correct on mine
janetlbeery: I have a + sign!
Math and Computer Science: good, no font problem
10:45AM
Robert Talbert: I tried this project using the "List" command, but I had to nest one list inside another because of the two variables. Is there any way to create a two-variable list in a single List command?
brooksbankpa: 1 mod 4?
Carter Lyons: p-1=2^2k for k>1
sklarjk: I'm sorry, could you repeat the meaning of intror?
sklarjk: Got distracted playing with GAP.
Math and Computer Science: I did the same, Robert, maybe Peter knows a way to do it. There's always using loops ...
sklarjk: For a and b in Z_p, yes?
Dominic Soda: so would you consider the proof of this conjecture as part of the course?
brooksbankpa: Robert: yes, but you end up with a matrix.
Robert Talbert: Was the correct conjecture for Project 1 supposed to be that the solution exists when p ~= 1 mod 4?
brooksbankpa: you can also use the Flat command to turn a matrix into a list.
Math and Computer Science: yes, 1 mod 4
Robert Talbert: Thanks. (Much more elegant than the one I came up with....)
10:50AM
brooksbankpa: I find Flat very useful.
Robert Talbert: Peter -- yes, that looks very handy. Thanks
Math and Computer Science: Because then you could search the list for the zero element using GAP
Math and Computer Science: moren easily
Math and Computer Science: more easily, that is
Donna Nonnenkamp: We are now changing the tape
Donna Nonnenkamp: New tape installed
10:55AM
Meral Arnavut: I cannot hear anything!
Donna Nonnenkamp: Please quit quicktime Meral and then restart it
Donna Nonnenkamp: Meral, can you hear us yet?
Meral Arnavut: Okey, I can hear now..
Meral Arnavut: Good.
Meral Arnavut: Can GAP also identify nilpotents rather than only finding the number of nilpotents?
11:00AM
Dominic Soda: i will email this i just did it
Meral Arnavut: Thanks!
Math and Computer Science: great!
Robert Talbert: 2^k
Carter Lyons: 2^k for k the # of distinct primes in the factorization of n.
Meral Arnavut: 2^n?
Meral Arnavut: Broadcast is Paused?
sklarjk: no
Math and Computer Science: no
Math and Computer Science: broadcast is running
Meral Arnavut: Okey, It is just my computer again.
Meral Arnavut: It is running now..
11:05AM
Donna Nonnenkamp: Good Meral
Dominic Soda: I can see using GAP in a rings-first approach after this mornings session
Dominic Soda: Using Z n and polynomial rings is usually enough a ring-first approach
11:10AM
Math and Computer Science: o.k. - I have never taught rings first.
Robert Talbert: So when we enter "Integers mod n", GAP assumes we mean the ring of integers mod n and not just the additive group?
Math and Computer Science: yes - it forms the ring
brooksbankpa: no looks good.
sklarjk: My audio is cutting out a lot for brief periods today. Is that happening to anyone else?
sklarjk: Audio=gone.
Math and Computer Science: do you have both audio and video open or areyou getting audio from the video feed?
sklarjk: Ok, restarting worked.
Donna Nonnenkamp: Good Jessica
11:15AM
Donna Nonnenkamp: The Gap website is now working
sklarjk has declined the invitation to this chat.
Robert Talbert: Interesting that GAP distinguishes between a "mapping" and a "function". If you try to evaluate f(2), for instance, it doesn't compute. But h(2) = 5 (where h(x) = e[5]*x)
sklarjk: I'm already here, Juli.
sklarjk has declined the invitation to this chat.
Math and Computer Science: ok jessica - you are not showing up in my chat room.
sklarjk: Huh... Funny...
Dominic Soda: i am confused by that MappingByFunction syntax
Dominic Soda: thanks
Robert Talbert: Can be especially confusing because Gallian's book (and most books) defines "function" and "mapping" to be synonyms!
11:20AM
brooksbankpa: h takes integer input OR ring element input, but f needs a ring element... you can evaluate f using Image(f,ZmodnZObj(2,10)) for example.
Ken Yanosko: these are idempotents?
11:25AM
Dominic Soda: a(xy)=(ax)(ay) must be true for x=1 and y=1 therefore a*a=a
Dominic Soda: yes
Janet McShane: Don't you need e2 in your h2?
drvazz: ...and now f2?
Tracy Hamilton: x is in z10 so don't you have to multiply it by something in z10 (i.e. e[] instead of e2[])?
11:30AM
brooksbankpa: but it seems to be happy regarding the image as something in z15?